Fernando, It doesn't have to be Emacs; it could be a generic Web browser for instance. What does need to change however is the somewhat broken model of black-box closed access technologies that force the rest of the industry to debug accessibility into existence. >>>>> "Fernando" == Fernando <my.lists@xxxxxxxxxxx> writes: Fernando> I agree we need a challenge, but I would argue that Fernando> rather than Nielsen, we should challenge ourselves Fernando> to bring the efficiency and effectiveness of Fernando> Emacspeak to more people. After all, Nielsen's Fernando> conclusions are scientifically valid for probably Fernando> 99% of all persons with disabilities currently Fernando> online. Fernando> Fernando> How this should or can take place, I do not Fernando> know. But I think we cannot blame users for falling Fernando> into the trap of inferior tools when they are not Fernando> aware of alternatives and when the alternatives are Fernando> so difficult to find, install, and learn. Fernando> Fernando> I have been trying to figure out ways to make Fernando> access to Emacs easier, and have also thought about Fernando> finding a way to fund a scientifically valid study Fernando> where Emacs is compared to more conventional tools, Fernando> so I am glad to see Raman bringing that idea up. Fernando> If anyone would like to be part of such a study, or Fernando> has suggestions of potential funding sources, etc, Fernando> please contact me directly. Fernando> Fernando> Fernando Botelho Fernando> Fernando> -----Original Message----- From: Janina Sajka Fernando> [mailto:janina@xxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Friday, December Fernando> 21, 2007 9:42 AM To: T. V. Raman Cc: Fernando> emacspeak@xxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: [emacspeak The Fernando> Complete Audio Desktop] Web Accessibility Fernando> AndUsability: Comin... Fernando> Fernando> You raise very valid points, Raman. Perhaps we Fernando> might consider a challenge to Nielsen. Perhaps we Fernando> could point out that their presuppositions are Fernando> unfair and lead to unhelpful conclusions? As you Fernando> point out, it's the task, not the particular web Fernando> site for that task, which matters. And, the Fernando> performance of users with minimal skills and Fernando> inadequate tools is certainly a questionable Fernando> measure. Fernando> Fernando> Janina Fernando> Fernando> T. V. Raman writes: >> The Nielsen Norman Group has made available a detailed >> report on accessibility, which includes the results of >> several usability tests --- see Going Beyond Alt >> Text. It's a very good read, and though its conclusions >> might be depressing to people coming to this area from the >> outside --- they should be no surprize to users who have >> been trying to use the Web via spoken output over the last >> 10 years. From the perspective of the Emacspeak user who >> lives in a specialized browsing environment that is >> optimized for performing oft-repeated tasks, there are >> several interesting take-aways from this report: >> >> - Though so-called Web Accessibility Standards have >> attempted to focus on the behavior observed when using >> screenreaders with mainstream browsers, that thread of >> work appears to be achieving little with respect to the >> real metric of task completion. As technologists, we would >> all do well to remember that users come to the Web, and >> Web Access solutions not to use the browser but rather to >> complete one or other task. - As described in Specialized >> Browsers and The Web The Way You Want It, task-oriented >> access and specialized user-optimized web tools have been >> around since the inception of the Web. - Though the >> Nielsen study asked users to carry out each of the given >> tasks by going to a given Web site, it would be >> interesting to see how such tasks work out in the >> Emacspeak environment. It's a given that an emacspeak user >> trying to buy a music CD at an online store would run into >> a brick wall fairly quickly (see, even online stores are >> made of brick and mortar;-)). However, as an Emacspeak >> user I'd never do that I'd either go to Amazon's highly >> efficient Amazon Accessible Store or faster yet, type an >> appropriate query at Google and click on the relevant Ad >> that sports a Google Checkout badge. - And more >> interestingly, it would be interesting to carry out a >> follow-up user study to compare the rate of task >> completion as well as observed efficiencies/inefficiencies >> between users of Emacspeak and generic >> browser/screenreader combinations for tasks such as: - >> Play NPR news from the last hour. - Play your local NPR >> station. - Play BBC News from the last hour. - Skim the >> top stories from CNN. - Look up today's stock market >> numbers for the major indices. - And items too numerous >> to enumerate in this margin. >> >> -- >> Posted By T. V. Raman to emacspeak The Complete Audio >> Desktop at 12/20/2007 02:49:00 PM Fernando> -- Fernando> Fernando> Janina Sajka, Phone: +1.202.595.7777; Fernando> sip:janina@xxxxxxxxxxx Partner, Capital Accessibility Fernando> LLC http://CapitalAccessibility.Com Fernando> Fernando> Marketing the Owasys 22C talking screenless cell Fernando> phone in the U.S. and Canada Learn more at Fernando> http://ScreenlessPhone.Com Fernando> Fernando> Chair, Open Accessibility janina@xxxxxxxxxxx Linux Fernando> Foundation http://a11y.org Fernando> Fernando> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Fernando> - To unsubscribe from the emacspeak list or change Fernando> your address on the emacspeak list send mail to Fernando> "emacspeak-request@xxxxxxxxxxx" with a subject of Fernando> "unsubscribe" or "help" Fernando> Fernando> Fernando> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- Fernando> To unsubscribe from the emacspeak list or change Fernando> your address on the emacspeak list send mail to Fernando> "emacspeak-request@xxxxxxxxxxx" with a subject of Fernando> "unsubscribe" or "help" -- Best Regards, --raman Email: raman@xxxxxxxxxxx WWW: http://emacspeak.sf.net/raman/ AIM: emacspeak GTalk: tv.raman.tv@xxxxxxxxxxx PGP: http://emacspeak.sf.net/raman/raman-almaden.asc Google: tv+raman IRC: irc://irc.freenode.net/#emacs ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the emacspeak list or change your address on the emacspeak list send mail to "emacspeak-request@xxxxxxxxxxx" with a subject of "unsubscribe" or "help"
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