Also, note that the w3 package available from the elpa archive is 4..0.46 -- the one in git is slightly ahead. For emacspeak use I would still recommend the version in git. Tim -- would you like to package up Rob's changes in the form of a patch built against the w3 git archive? We can in the least host it as a patch on the emacspeak svn site. -- -- On 5/8/12, Tim Cross <tcross@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > Hi Rob, > > Wow, your style sheet and settings do appear to have fixed the issue. This > has > me stumped - I was obviously missing something and would swear I had tried > those exact settings before. I must have not been refreshing something or > had > something wrong with my stylesheet or something else enabled or more likely, > a > bit of all of the above. I cannot tell you how many frustrating hours I > spent > trying to get this sorted!. > > Now I've applied some of the stuff from Raman's w3-prepare file, I also > find > that the epub stuff is working great! This is just fantastic as I find the > rendering of html pages from epub files much better than the old conversion > of > text from PDF files. It also means that perhaps on the weekend, I might be > able > to get epub and w3m working as now I have an idea what I'm aiming at and > can > make sure whatever I do doesn't break existing stuff. > > The really nice thing is that since machines have gotten so much faster in > the > past few years, the slower rendering time of w3 compared to w3m is pretty > much > unnoticeable except on really large html files. > > thanks again, you have made my day! > > Tim > > > > Robert D. Crawford writes: > > I think I have the set-up you are looking for. I have the following > > variables that seem to be pertinent: > > > > '(w3-default-stylesheet "~/.w3/default.css") > > '(w3-honor-stylesheets nil) > > '(w3-user-colors-take-precedence t) > > '(w3-user-fonts-take-precedence t) > > > > I have also attached my default.css file. I have a black background > > with the paragraph text in white. Since we are both in the same boat as > > concerns vision, I think this will work for you... that is unless > > something else is in the way. > > > > Best regards, > > rdc > > > > > /****************************************************************************** > > ** File: default.css > > ** Purpose: Default Stylesheet for Emacs/W3 > > ** Info: Copyright (c) 1995-1996 William M. Perry > <wmperry@xxxxxxxxxxx> > > ** Copyright (c) 1997 Free Software Foundation, Inc. > > ** Created: William M. Perry <wmperry@xxxxxxxxxxx>, Aug-31-1995 > > ** Maintainer: William M. Perry <wmperry@xxxxxxxxxxx> > > ** > > ** This contains the top level fallback default styles for Emacs/W3 > > ** > > > ******************************************************************************* > > ** > > ** To specify device-dependent styles, you must mark a section with > > ** @media devicetype { ... } > > ** If you are not using 'devicetype', then anything within the { ... } > > ** is ignored. > > ** > > ** These sections are currently defined by > > ** http://www.w3.org/pub/WWW/Style/Group/WD-PRINT-961220 > > ** > > ** print - output for paged opaque material, and for documents > viewed > > ** on screen in print preview mode > > ** screen - a continuous presentation of computer screens > > ** projector - paged presentation for projected presentations > > ** braille - for braille tactile feedback devices > > ** speech - aural presentation > > ** all - the default value, applies to all output devices > > ** > > ** There are a few special Emacs/W3 sections > > ** > > ** emacs - only include this chunk if you are using Emacs 19 > > ** xemacs - only include this chunk if you are using XEmacs > > ** multifont - only include this chunk if you are using a multi-font > capable Emacs variant > > ** unifont - only include this chunk if you are using a uni-font > capable Emacs variant > > ** light - only include this chunk if you are using a light > background > > ** dark - only include this chunk if you are using a dark > background > > ** tty - only include this chunk if you are using a TTY > > ** ansi-tty - only include this chunk if you are using an ANSI-capable > TTY > > > ******************************************************************************* > > ** > > ** There are some things this stylesheet cannot really specify, that we > > ** must rely on the browser to explicitly handle correctly: > > ** > > ** o table formatting > > ** o actually creating a hyperlink from an <a> tag and its attributes > > ** o specifying which tags open lists > > ** o inlined images > > ** o frames (perhaps with positioning) > > ** o applet/script/embed/object > > ** o horizontal rules > > > ******************************************************************************/ > > > > body { > > background-color: black; > > color: white; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 18pt; > > } > > > > p { > > color: white; > > font-weight: normal; > > display: block; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 18pt; > > } > > > > img { > > color: black; > > font-weight: bold; > > display: block; > > background-color: dodgerblue; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 12pt; > > } > > > > > > br { > > display: line; > > } > > > > hr { > > display: line; > > text-align: center; > > } > > > > span { > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 18pt; > > } > > > > h1 { > > displayy: block; > > color: steelblue3; > > font-weight: bold; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 30pt; > > } > > > > h2 { > > displayy: block; > > color: steelblue3; > > font-weight: bold; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 26pt; > > } > > > > h3 { > > displayy: block; > > color: steelblue3; > > font-weight: bold; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 22pt; > > } > > > > h4 { > > displayy: block; > > color: steelblue3; > > font-weight: bold; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 18pt; > > } > > > > h5 { > > displayy: block; > > color: steelblue3; > > font-weight: bold; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 16pt; > > } > > > > h6 { > > displayy: block; > > color: steelblue3; > > font-weight: bold; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 16pt; > > } > > > > pre,xmp,plaintext { > > display: block; > > white-space: pre; > > color: chocolate1; > > font-family: monospace; > > background-color: black; > > font-size: 18pt; > > margin: 0px 15px > > } > > > > key,code,tt,kbd,var { > > display: block; > > color: chocolate1; > > font-family: monospace; > > background-color: black; > > font-size: 18pt; > > margin: 0px 15px > > } > > > > blockquote { > > display: block; > > margin-left: 1em; > > margin-right: 1em; > > background-color: black; > > color: white; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 18pt; > > } > > > > ul { > > display: block; > > list-style: disc; > > } > > > > ol { > > display: block; > > list-style: decimal; > > } > > > > dl { > > display: block; > > } > > > > dir { > > display: block; > > } > > > > menu { > > display: block; > > } > > > > dt { > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > font-weight: bold; > > display: line; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 18pt; > > } > > > > dd { > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > display: line; > > margin-left: 1.5em; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 18pt; > > } > > > > li { > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > display: list-item; > > margin-left: 0.5em; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: 18pt; > > } > > > > /* These are to make nested list items look better */ > > ul ul,ol ul,ol ol,ul ol { > > display: line; > > } > > > > div { > > display: line; > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +8pt; */ > > } > > > > strong,em,b { > > color: blue; > > background-color: black; > > font-weight: bold; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > dfn { > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > font-style: italic; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > s,strike { > > color: green; > > background-color: black; > > text-decoration: line-through; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > sub { > > text-position: sub; > > } > > > > sup { > > text-position: sup; > > } > > > > secret { > > text-transform: rot13; > > } > > > > i { > > color: orange1; > > background-color: black; > > font-style: bold; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > u { > > color: orange; > > background-color: black; > > text-decoration: underline; > > font-style: bold; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > center { > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > display: line; > > text-align: center; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > /* > > ** Hypertext link coloring > > */ > > > > a:link { > > color: dodgerblue; > > font-style: bold; > > background-color: black; > > text-decoration: underline; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > a:visited { > > color: red; > > font-style: bold; > > background-color: black; > > text-decoration: underline; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > a:active { > > color: maroon; > > font-style: bold; > > background-color: black; > > text-decoration: underline; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > /* > > ** Table formatting > > */ > > > > table { > > display: block; > > background-color: black; > > color: white; > > } > > > > th { > > display: block; > > font-weight: bold; > > text-align: center; > > background-color: black; > > color: blue; > > font-family: monospace; > > font-size: +12pt; > > } > > > > td { > > display: block; > > text-align: left; > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > caption { > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > display: block; > > text-align: center; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > /* > > ** Various other character-level formatting issues > > */ > > > > address { > > text-align: right; > > display: line; > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > abstract { > > font-style: bold & italic; > > text-align: indent; > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > quote,q,cite { > > font-style: italic; > > text-align: indent; > > color: white; > > background-color: black; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > /* > > ** How to draw form elements. > > ** This is an extension in Emacs/W3 (and perhaps soon E-Scape) > > ** Since there are so many different types of input fields, you should > be > > ** able to control formatting based on that. Enter pseudo-classes. > > ** > > ** This functionality will be removed as soon as the W3C comes up with > > ** the standard way to do this, perhaps in CSS level 2. > > */ > > > > input:int, > > input:float, > > input:url, > > input:password, > > input:text { > > text-decoration: underline; > > background-color: black; > > color: white; > > font-style: bold; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > input:submit { > > color: green; > > text-decoration: none; > > font-style: bold; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > input:reset { > > color: red; > > text-decoration: none; > > font-style: bold; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > input:button { > > color: yellow; > > text-decoration: none; > > font-style: bold; > > font-family: monospace; > > /* font-size: +12pt; */ > > } > > > > input:image { > > text-decoration: none; > > font-style: bold; > > } > > > > /* > > ** Secial styles for the Emacspeak subsystem of emacs - an incredibly > cool > > ** speech synthesizer. This was contributed by T.V. Raman > (raman@xxxxxxxxxxx) > > */ > > > > @media speech { > > h1,h2,h3, > > h4,h5,h6 { voice-family: paul; stress: 2; richness: 9; } > > h1 { pitch: 1; pitch-range: 9; } > > h2 { pitch: 2; pitch-range: 8; } > > h3 { pitch: 3; pitch-range: 7; } > > h4 { pitch: 4; pitch-range: 6; } > > h5 { pitch: 5; pitch-range: 5; } > > h6 { pitch: 6; pitch-range: 4; } > > > > li,dt,dd { pitch: 6; richness: 6; } > > dt { stress: 8; } > > th { pitch: 6; pitch-range: 6; stress: 9; richness: 9; } > > > > pre,xmp,plaintext,key,code,tt { pitch: 5; > > pitch-range: 0; > > stress: 0; > > richness: 8; > > } > > > > em { pitch: 6; pitch-range: 6; stress: 6; richness: 5; } > > strong { pitch: 6; pitch-range: 6; stress: 9; richness: 9; } > > dfn { pitch: 7; pitch-range: 6; stress: 6; } > > s,strike { richness: 0; } > > i { pitch: 8; pitch-range: 6; stress: 6; richness: 5 } > > blockquote { pitch: 6; pitch-range: 6; stress: 6; richness: 5 } > > b { pitch: 2; pitch-range: 4; stress: 5; richness: 9; } > > u { richness: 0; } > > a:link { voice-family: betty; pitch: 3; richness: 9; } > > //pitch: 0; > > a:visited { voice-family: betty; pitch: 7; richness: 9;} > > a:active { voice-family: betty; pitch-range: 8; pitch: 8 } > > img { pitch: 6; pitch-range: 6; stress: 6; richness: 5; } > > > > } // @media speech > > > > /* > > ** All the TTY specific formatting > > */ > > > > @media tty { > > /* > > ** First, handle some stuff for generic TTYs to emulate our old > > ** behaviour with w3-delimit-links and a subset of w3-delimit-emphasis > > */ > > > > h1,h2,h3, > > h4,h5,h6 { > > insert-before: *; > > insert-after: * > > } > > > > a:visited{ > > insert-before: "{{"; > > insert-after: "}}" > > } > > > > a:link { > > insert-before: "[["; > > insert-after: "]]" > > } > > > > input:text, > > input:int, > > input:float, > > input:url, > > input:file, > > input:password, > > input:text { insert-before: "[{"; insert-after: "}]"; } > > select { insert-before: "[{"; insert-after: "}]"; } > > > > } // @media tty > > > > > > @media ansi-tty { > > /* > > ** Now comes the cool TTY stuff. You will need to be using XEmacs 19.14 > > ** or later (or Emacs 19.30 under DOS) in order to get any benefit from > > ** these whatsoever. But if you are using one of these, wow, cool, eh? > > ** > > ** ANSI specifies these colors, and most (all?) TTYs that support color > > ** will generally have 2 versions. One normal and one bright or > 'standout' > > ** version. > > ** > > ** Color R G B > > ** -------------------------- > > ** white - 1.0 , 1.0 , 1.0 > > ** cyan - 0.0 , 1.0 , 1.0 > > ** magenta - 1.0 , 0.0 , 1.0 > > ** blue - 0.0 , 0.0 , 1.0 > > ** yellow - 1.0 , 1.0 , 0.0 > > ** green - 0.0 , 1.0 , 0.0 > > ** red - 1.0 , 0.0 , 0.0 > > ** black - 0.0 , 0.0 , 0.0 > > */ > > > > h1,h2,h3, > > h4,h5,h6 { color : cyan } > > a:visited { color : magenta } > > a:link { color : red } > > a:active { color : yellow } > > } // @media ansi-tty > > > > @media experimental { > > table { display: table; } > > tr { display: table-row; } > > thead { display: table-header-group; } > > tbody { display: table-row-group; } > > tfoot { display: table-footer-group; } > > col { display: table-column; } > > colgroup { display: table-column-group; } > > td, th { display: table-cell; } > > caption { display: table-caption; } > > } // @media experimental > > > > > > Tim Cross <theophilusx@xxxxxxxxxxx> writes: > > > > > thanks Raman. Will look into the mime stuff. > > > > > > Unfortunately, colour themes, x-resources and face customizations are > > > all no good with w3 and have no effect. The w3 code dynamically > > > creates faces on the fly. I've looked at this stuff in the past, but > > > it is quite complicated and I tend to disappear down the rabbit whole > > > each time I try to get a handle on it. Part of the problem is that the > > > issue appears to be a combination of many smaller issues, so fixing > > > one doesn't help - you need to fix them all. Some of them are similar > > > to issues that have come up in other areas - for example, having a > > > decent metric to ensure foreground/background colours are distinct or > > > distant enough from each other to be readable, dealing with > > > inconsistent/bad style settings, recognition of some users preference > > > for a black/dark background etc etc. > > > > > > I've made several attempts to fix/improve this in the past, but either > > > get distracted or loose momentum. However, I'm very keen to get decent > > > epub support within emacspeak, so maybe there is more motivation to > > > try harder! The first thing I need to do is increase my knowledge re: > > > CSS, DOM, etc. This has not been a focus in my work for the last 10+ > > > years, so I'm not up to speed in this area yet. > > > > > > Always good to have a new challenge! Just wish I could work on this > > > stuff all the time and not spend so many mind numbing hours in the > > > corporate world, where technology seems to be relegated to the > > > basement, being replaced by project managers, cloud services and > > > vendor management! If I had better cane skills and could move faster, > > > bank robbery would be a serious option. > > > > > > Tim > > > > > > On 9 May 2012 01:17, T.V. Raman <tv.raman.tv@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > >> Mime t tweaking -- admittedly this is a mess with w3. > > >> > > >> I believe my patches included a modification where > > >> application/xhtml+xml was handled on the same lines as text/html > > >> --- you also need to customize some of the mm- variables. Check > > >> in emacspeak/tvr -- if not already there, I'll check in the > > >> settings you need. > > >> > > >> For the white-on-white problem, try switching emacs color themes > > >> -- > > >> -- > > >> > > >> -- > > >> > > >> > > >> On 5/7/12, Tim Cross <theophilusx@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > >>> The quick and dirty 'fix' I applied for this werror is to comment > out > > >>> the two lines from w3-speak.el which require > emacspeak-fix-interactive > > >>> at cimpile time. This stops the make process from exiting early and > > >>> ensures the rest of the *.el files are compiled. It does not appear > to > > >>> have any dramatic impact. > > >>> > > >>> Raman, I looked at your patch from your w3 and I think your right. > It > > >>> looks like all you changes do is remove some of the excessive > > >>> 'padding' w3 was doing when rendering things like lists and > > >>> blockquote. On my system, the unmodified version would put boxquote > > >>> elements and lists right over on the right hand side - so much so > that > > >>> blockquotes would end up being rendered as only one or two words per > > >>> line. I found that modifying the default.css file to change all > margin > > >>> settings from 5em to 1em greatly improved things. > > >>> > > >>> One remaining and extremely frustrating issue I have is that on some > > >>> pages, regardless of style sheet settings, w3 renders the page with > > >>> white background and white foreground/text or white background and > > >>> light grey text. As someone who actualy finds looking at a screen > with > > >>> a white background physically painful, this is somewhat frustrating. > I > > >>> did look at this a while back as it was the main reason I stopped > > >>> ujsing w3 and from memory, it is due to a bad interaction with pages > > >>> that have either forced a background colour and don't set any > > >>> text/foreground colour and/or conflicts between css settings and > 'hard > > >>> coded' page settings. Maybe it is time to look at it again. > > >>> > > >>> I also suspect I have to do some MIME tweaking. When using the epub > > >>> feature, it works with some epub titles, but fails with others. In > > >>> particular, seems to fail with titles generated primarily for the > > >>> kindle. With these titles, instead of opening the content, it asks > me > > >>> where to same the MIME object. Need to investigate further. > > >>> > > >>> Tim > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> On 8 May 2012 14:09, T. V. Raman <tv.raman.tv@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > >>>> this error has been around for a long time and shouldn't affect > anything. > > >>>> > > >>>>>>>>> "Bart" == Bart Bunting <bart@xxxxxxxxxxx> writes: > > >>>> Bart> Raman, et al, Whilst we are discussing w3 I am seeing > > >>>> Bart> issues when doing a make on the w3 source. It appears > > >>>> Bart> to be related to emacspeak libraries not being found. > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> Having said that w3 itself appears to work even with > > >>>> Bart> the error. > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> Is this normal? > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> I see this both under linux and on my mac. > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> Here is the make error: > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> bart@xxxxxxxxxxx:~/.emacs.d/src/w3$make cd lisp && make w3 > > >>>> Bart> > GNUSDIR=/usr/local/emacs/24.96/share/emacs/24.0.96/lisp/gnus/ > > >>>> Bart> > URLDIR=/usr/local/emacs/24.96/share/emacs/24.0.96/lisp/url/ > > >>>> Bart> W3SRCDIR=. emacs -batch -q -no-site-file -l ./docomp.el > > >>>> Bart> -l > > >>>> Bart> > /usr/local/emacs/24.96/share/emacs/24.0.96/lisp/url//url-vars.el > > >>>> Bart> -l ./w3-vars.el -f batch-byte-compile w3-display.el > > >>>> Bart> uncompressing url-vars.el.gz... uncompressing > > >>>> Bart> url-vars.el.gz...done Wrote w3-display.elc > > >>>> Bart> > GNUSDIR=/usr/local/emacs/24.96/share/emacs/24.0.96/lisp/gnus/ > > >>>> Bart> > URLDIR=/usr/local/emacs/24.96/share/emacs/24.0.96/lisp/url/ > > >>>> Bart> W3SRCDIR=. emacs -batch -q -no-site-file -l ./docomp.el > > >>>> Bart> -l > > >>>> Bart> > /usr/local/emacs/24.96/share/emacs/24.0.96/lisp/url//url-vars.el > > >>>> Bart> -l ./w3-vars.el -f batch-byte-compile w3-speak.el > > >>>> Bart> uncompressing url-vars.el.gz... uncompressing > > >>>> Bart> url-vars.el.gz...done > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> In toplevel form: w3-speak.el:49:1:Error: Cannot open > > >>>> Bart> load file: emacspeak-fix-interactive make[1]: *** > > >>>> Bart> [w3-speak.elc] Error 1 make: *** [w3] Error 2 > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> Cheers > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> Bart > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> Bart> "T.V. Raman" <tv.raman.tv@xxxxxxxxxxx> writes: > > >>>> Bart> > > >>>> >> Tim, Per your suggestion, I have checked in > > >>>> >> emacspeak/tvr/tvr-w3.patch --- the patch was created from > > >>>> >> my local snapshot with git diff origin/master > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> after making sure that git pull -a claimed my local > > >>>> >> snapshot was uptodate. > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> Glancing at the patch -- I dont see anything significant > > >>>> >> that should make w3 work here and not from the git repo. > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> The git repo I am refering to is: git config > > >>>> >> remote.origin.url git://git.sv.gnu.org/w3.git > > >>>> >> -- > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> -- > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> On 5/7/12, Tim Cross <theophilusx@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > >>>> >>> Hi Raman, > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >>> I've been attempting to get w3 working and while I've > > >>>> >>> finally got it going, it was not trivial. > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >>> I think part of the problem is that there has been no > > >>>> >>> updates to the w3 repository since May 2008. I know there > > >>>> >>> has been a couple of patches from you and others to fix > > >>>> >>> various bugs, but hunting them down and applying them is > > >>>> >>> not easy. On this basis, I wanted to make a suggestion. > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >>> Would it be possible for you to do a diff against the > > >>>> >>> current w3 repository code and the version of w3 you are > > >>>> >>> running and put the diffs in a w3-patches directory > > >>>> >>> within the emacspeak distribution. This would make it > > >>>> >>> esier to anyone wanting to run w3 to apply the same > > >>>> >>> patches you have been using. In addition to making it > > >>>> >>> easier for users, it may help in tracking down problems > > >>>> >>> as we will have a common base everyone is working from. > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >>> regards, > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >>> Tim > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >>> -- > > >>>> >>> Tim Cross > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>>> >>> To unsubscribe from the emacspeak list or change your > > >>>> >>> address on the emacspeak list send mail to > > >>>> >>> "emacspeak-request@xxxxxxxxxxx" with a subject of > > >>>> >>> "unsubscribe" or "help". > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >>> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> >> > > >>>> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >>>> >> To unsubscribe from the emacspeak list or change your > > >>>> >> address on the emacspeak list send mail to > > >>>> >> "emacspeak-request@xxxxxxxxxxx" with a subject of > > >>>> >> "unsubscribe" or "help". > > >>>> > > >>>> -- > > >>>> Best Regards, > > >>>> --raman > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> -- > > >>> Tim Cross > > >>> > > > > -- > > Robert D. Crawford > robdcraw@xxxxxxxxxxx > > -- > Tim Cross > Information Technology > University of New England > Phone: +61 2 6773 3210 > Mobile: 0428 212217 > Fax: +61 2 6773 3424 > E-Mail: tcross@xxxxxxxxxxx > Web: http://www.une.edu.au/itd > --- > Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. > See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html > > Any fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a > touch of genius (and a lot of courage) to move in the opposite direction. > —Albert Einstein > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the emacspeak list or change your address on the > emacspeak list send mail to "emacspeak-request@xxxxxxxxxxx" with a > subject of "unsubscribe" or "help". > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the emacspeak list or change your address on the emacspeak list send mail to "emacspeak-request@xxxxxxxxxxx" with a subject of "unsubscribe" or "help".
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