Emacspeak discussion list

[Robert Melton <lists AT robertmelton.com>]

John--

When I first started using Emacs and Emacspeaks I tried that version and had 
unending issues wit h it and haven't been back to test it since.  I will add 
it back into my list to test.  Presently I am testing the Macports versions. 

> On Jan 7, 2024, at 13:27, John Covici <covici AT ccs.covici.com> wrote:
> 
> Here is the emacs verrsion I have:
> Warning: Treating railwaycat/emacsmacport/emacs-mac as a formula. For
> the cask, use railwaycat/emacsmacport/emacs-mac
> ==> railwaycat/emacsmacport/emacs-mac: stable emacs-28.2-mac-9.1, HEAD
> YAMAMOTO Mitsuharu's Mac port of GNU Emacs
> https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/
> /opt/homebrew/Cellar/emacs-mac/emacs-28.2-mac-9.1 (4,116 files,
> 128.1MB) *
>  Built from source on 2023-04-06 at 21:15:41
>  From:
>  
> https://github.com/railwaycat/homebrew-emacsmacport/blob/HEAD/Formula/emacs-mac.rb
> 
> On Sun, 07 Jan 2024 12:00:49 -0500,
> Robert Melton wrote:
>> 
>> Question for the mac users on the list... what emacs are you using? 
>> 
>> I have been using Emacs-plus for a long time, but it seems for testing 
>> swiftmac, I am going to have to install some other versions.  The ones I 
>> know of are:
>> 
>> - Brew standard Emacs (is this most popular?)
>> - Source built 
>> - Macport version. 
>> 
>> and the one I use: 
>> 
>> - Emacs-plus via brew
>> 
>> Are there major versions I am missing?  
>> 
>>> On Jan 7, 2024, at 11:37, John Covici <covici AT ccs.covici.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Yep, and this is why I thought your server was doing something
>>> strange,  but maybe its something else.
>>> 
>>> On Sun, 07 Jan 2024 09:42:20 -0500,
>>> Robert Melton (via emacspeak Mailing List) wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> [1  <text/plain; us-ascii (quoted-printable)>]
>>>> But this works with the "mac" python server? 
>>>> 
>>>>> On Jan 7, 2024, at 09:13, John Covici <covici AT ccs.covici.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> There is a variable in the version of emacs I am using
>>>>> mac-ignore-accessibility  which seems to be no longer working with
>>>>> swiftmac -- not sure of the interaction here but there is something
>>>>> going on.
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Sun, 07 Jan 2024 08:28:03 -0500,
>>>>> Robert Melton (via emacspeak Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> [1  <text/plain; us-ascii (quoted-printable)>]
>>>>>> Regarding the double-speaking, modern macs have a fairly elegant 
>>>>>> solution that doesn't require any code changes, and comes with MacOS. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> VoiceOver Utility lets you turn off voiceover when in certain windows. 
>>>>>>  It is rules oriented so when you leave the window it turns back on, 
>>>>>> you do these via "Activities" in the voiceover utility. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Alternatively, as TV said, there are builds that seem to (bug of 
>>>>>> feature) turn off voiceover in the buffer (emacs-plus does this from 
>>>>>> brew). This has the advantage that it doesn't break menu access.  Menu 
>>>>>> access gets broken in the activity technique because you are still in 
>>>>>> emacs, so it will continue to have voiceover off. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Jan 6, 2024, at 23:31, T.V Raman <raman AT google.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I'd find a speech-server  tat turns off a screenreader with which it
>>>>>>> has no relationship strange indeed; even if the Mac server does that
>>>>>>> --- something I'd find surprizing --- I'd stil suggest thinking
>>>>>>> through this carefully before apeing that behavior.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> For instance, you can run the spech-server outside Emacspeak, e.g. to
>>>>>>> test the speech-server stand-alone. The speech-servver turning off
>>>>>>> other Assistive Tech in that situation would be surprizing   to the
>>>>>>> user.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> "Robert Melton" (via emacspeak Mailing List) writes:
>>>>>>>> Pitch shift should work on caps, I will confirm it.  
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> The automatically turning off, I will look at the mac server for how 
>>>>>>>> they do that in python, I simply have my voiceover automatically 
>>>>>>>> turn off for emacs, having it naturally turn off would be much 
>>>>>>>> better. 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> The punctuation work perfect for me, read out dash dash.  
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Jan 6, 2024, at 18:28, John Covici <covici AT ccs.covici.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Well, I installed successfully, a few questions./problems remain.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> I was hoping for capitalization to be available, by pitch changes, 
>>>>>>>>> am
>>>>>>>>> I mistaken?  Also, voiceover is on in the emacspeak window -- isn't 
>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>> supposed to be off in that window only automatically?  I am pretty
>>>>>>>>> sure it works that way with the default serverr.  I will also have 
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> see if I am doing something wrong with my punctuation settings,
>>>>>>>>> when I was trying to reply to your email, I was not hearing any
>>>>>>>>> dashes  in a line like the following:
>>>>>>>>> --text follows this line--
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Otherwise, seems pretty good, I am even getting sounds!!
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Thanks for all yyour hard work.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 03 Jan 2024 14:29:14 -0500,
>>>>>>>>> Robert Melton wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> I meant to type restart, not resetr. 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Also, you will have to set swiftmac as you dtk-program 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> (setq dtk-program "swiftmac")
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> or however you set yours. 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> On Jan 3, 2024, at 13:38, John Covici <covici AT ccs.covici.com> 
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> OK, thanks -- what do you mean by "reset emacs"?
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 03 Jan 2024 13:09:49 -0500,
>>>>>>>>>>> Robert Melton (via emacspeak Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> [1  <text/plain; us-ascii (quoted-printable)>]
>>>>>>>>>>>> It is in the current emacspeak git version, so will go out with 
>>>>>>>>>>>> next major release.
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> If you don't want to wait, or want a more cutting edge version 
>>>>>>>>>>>> then use:
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> https://github.com/robertmeta/swiftmac
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> after you get it just "make install" to build and install from 
>>>>>>>>>>>> the root directory, then reset emacs.
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> README.md and some project aspects will undergo rapid change in 
>>>>>>>>>>>> the next few days, as it now has shifted purpose a bit. 
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jan 3, 2024, at 12:52, John Covici <covici AT ccs.covici.com> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, where do I get this serverr exactly and what version of 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> emacs and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> emacspeak are required?  I do have xcode here, so is that what 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to compile this?
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks a lot.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 03 Jan 2024 10:59:43 -0500,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Robert Melton (via emacspeak Mailing List) wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [1  <text/plain; us-ascii (quoted-printable)>]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hey swiftmac users! 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I contributed swiftmac to emacspeak proper at the last 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> possible moment of 2023, because I wanted to do it last year. 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> :) 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That said, I heard your feedback and while T.V. has been 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> awesome enough to just accept my patches as long as as I stay 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to my Swiftmac subtree (thanks again!)... I understand that 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you want to continue using stable releases of Emacspeak!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, I am tweaking my Swiftmac repo to be the cutting edge 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> version, and place to track bug reports.  When it hits nice 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stable points or critical bug fixes I will be pushing those up 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to emacspeak. 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Still puzzling out the best way to accomplish this, but for 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now I will just make the changes to emacspeak by hand when the 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> code gets to a point I think it should be moved over. 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bugs still exist, report them at 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://github.com/robertmeta/swiftmac/issues
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I will still be creating fat-binaries from time to time to 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support the users who can not run swift to build the project.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Version 2, the rewrite using the newer mac audio subsystem 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> will be up around the end of the month under the v2 branch, 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but it is likely not going to be easy to use day to day unless 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you want to contribute and know swift.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks everyone for the support. 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [2  <text/plain; UTF-8 (8bit)>]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Emacspeak discussion list -- emacspeak AT emacspeak.net
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send email to:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> emacspeak-request AT emacspeak.net with a subject of: unsubscribe
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Your life is like a penny.  You're going to lose it.  The 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> question is:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> How do
>>>>>>>>>>>>> you spend it?
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>>   John Covici wb2una
>>>>>>>>>>>>>   covici AT ccs.covici.com
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> [2  <text/plain; UTF-8 (8bit)>]
>>>>>>>>>>>> Emacspeak discussion list -- emacspeak AT emacspeak.net
>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send email to:
>>>>>>>>>>>> emacspeak-request AT emacspeak.net with a subject of: unsubscribe
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>>>>> Your life is like a penny.  You're going to lose it.  The 
>>>>>>>>>>> question is:
>>>>>>>>>>> How do
>>>>>>>>>>> you spend it?
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>    John Covici wb2una
>>>>>>>>>>>    covici AT ccs.covici.com
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>>> Your life is like a penny.  You're going to lose it.  The question 
>>>>>>>>> is:
>>>>>>>>> How do
>>>>>>>>> you spend it?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>     John Covici wb2una
>>>>>>>>>     covici AT ccs.covici.com
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>> Emacspeak discussion list -- emacspeak AT emacspeak.net
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe send email to:
>>>>>>>> emacspeak-request AT emacspeak.net with a subject of: unsubscribe
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> [2  <text/plain; UTF-8 (8bit)>]
>>>>>> Emacspeak discussion list -- emacspeak AT emacspeak.net
>>>>>> To unsubscribe send email to:
>>>>>> emacspeak-request AT emacspeak.net with a subject of: unsubscribe
>>>>> 
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> Your life is like a penny.  You're going to lose it.  The question is:
>>>>> How do
>>>>> you spend it?
>>>>> 
>>>>>       John Covici wb2una
>>>>>       covici AT ccs.covici.com
>>>> 
>>>> [2  <text/plain; UTF-8 (8bit)>]
>>>> Emacspeak discussion list -- emacspeak AT emacspeak.net
>>>> To unsubscribe send email to:
>>>> emacspeak-request AT emacspeak.net with a subject of: unsubscribe
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Your life is like a penny.  You're going to lose it.  The question is:
>>> How do
>>> you spend it?
>>> 
>>>        John Covici wb2una
>>>        covici AT ccs.covici.com
>> 
>> 
> 
> -- 
> Your life is like a penny.  You're going to lose it.  The question is:
> How do
> you spend it?
> 
>         John Covici wb2una
>         covici AT ccs.covici.com